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Discussion Starter #1
:( I feel really really bad tonight megan was being really naughty tonight same old story when we don't let her up on the sofa which we never have done but she jumps up anyway if we don't go down on the floor with her she goes under the tv unit and starts pulling out cables so I have to go get her so tell her no and shekeeps trying to bite me really bite me not playing so I'm sorry to say this I pinned her for her to submit but she did not submit she went mad when i did let her go she was jumping and going for me again I feel so bad for what I've done and hope she doesn't hate me for it now anyone got any advice I could use some wise words thanks everyone
 

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Hi emmark

We pinned Catan at that age until he settled. Eventually he would give in and calm down. Unfortunately when we started puppy classes they told us it was the absolute wrong thing to do becasue as they get older you don't want to have that power struggle with them. Now that Catan is 9 months old I couldn't possibly pin him as he's way to strong.

We were told when he's getting into everything to just tie him to you. Catan has spent many hours with his leash tied around an ankle. If they're biting you yelp and take yourself away.
 

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I know what you mean emm. The first couple of times I tried to pin Kian when he was young I got nowhere. Now if I do it at 6 months he knows that he needs to relax. Once I let him go he will lay there for about a minute and then he will simply get up and lick my face ;D
keep at it, she's just a puppy. better to get her used to it now then try when she is older.

As Lisa suggested try tieing her to you or ties her off somewhere else in the house as a "time out" Yes, she'll cry and whine but she will eventually stop.
 

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I did it at that age with same results, but now he is fine when i do it and goes very submissive
 

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By no means should you feel bad! in the doggy world that's how the dominant dog would show that something wasn't ok with them. As an owner you MUST be the dominant dog in your pack if your dog doesn't know the rankings in your household they'll automatically dub themselves the leader and we all by no means want that! that's when they stop listening to you. We have a pitt/Weim mix who is VERY stubborn! she's tested us in every way possible. When we put her down she 99% of the time never does what she did to be put down again. We put our 3 month old vizsla down because as sweet as he is he can be such a terror! lol plus it's the best and fastest way for them to submit to you and it makes it a lot easier to train them when they know you're their leader. PLUS i have to say its a form of positive training, instead of you yelling at them and all them hearing is blah blah blah putting them down directly shows them you did not like what they just did! (of course you have to do it in a 10 second window or they have absolutely no clue why you're doing it) Hope this helps you and everyone else feel better about it! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It has made me feel alot better thanks everyone she really does need to learn who's boss she's a terror !
 

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If you've ever been around a bitch with puppies you will have seen that that is what they do with an unruly pup. Only they hold them down with the only grasping tool they have, their mouths. It may appear that she's biting them but she's just telling them that their behavior is unacceptable.
 

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We did try it with Rosie. I've since been reading a fair amount and talking with our puppy instructor about other methods based on operant conditioning (especially reinforcement for desirable behavior, removal of reinforcement for undesirable behavior). In this case, removal of reinforcement often means you walking away for a few minutes and coming back. This is what ultimately worked best for us. To back this up a bit, there is some research suggesting that pinning and other methods of correction may sometimes backfire, make the animal more likely rather than less likely to be aggressive. See link for American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior position on use of dominance theory in training. http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonline/images/stories/Position_Statements/dominance%20statement.pdf

Others have other viewpoints and experiences, so take this one for what it's worth. And don't feel bad--I highly doubt whatever you choose to do or not do will ruin or alienate your puppy. Anyway, FWIW, I copy below a tip sheet, also from AVSAB:

What To Do When Puppies Bite and Lose Control

A few years ago, friends of ours rescued a 4 month old puppy from an abusive situation. Although her heritage is unknown, Pi is likely a pit-bull type mix of some sort. She is a sweet and friendly pup, both with people and other dogs, but like any 4 month old puppy she has her moments of craziness.

After a full day of walks in the snow and play with our dogs, that evening, while playing, Pi seemed to turn into all teeth. She was chasing and snapping at the other dogs and bit at her owner’s hand as he gently held her and tried to calm her down. Given her questionable genetic and environmental background, her owners were understandably worried that Pi’s outburst might be a sign of aggressive problems to come.

Over the years, many new puppy owners have contacted us with similar concerns. We remember the power of puppy teeth from when our Irish setter, Coral, was young. Coral’s silly antics as a puppy earned her the nickname “Bacchanal Lady”, after one of our favorite songs.

Having spent several days with Pi, we are fairly certain that even her whirling dervish episode was not something out of the ordinary. When puppies become overly stimulated and overly tired but still want to keep going and going they seem to lose what little self-control their young minds and bodies have been able to develop.

As soon as we put Pi in the car, she immediately fell asleep, evidence of how tired she was. New puppy parents need to learn to recognize when their puppies are overwhelmed, and need some private, quiet time to nap and rest. This is especially important when puppies are growing up in families with children.

With regard to puppy nipping and biting in general, we agree with a comment our friend and colleague Dr. Amy Marder made years ago – most of this normal puppy nipping behavior just goes away, regardless of how much or how little puppy parents do to stop it. Puppies are teething, and also use their mouths to explore their world so their “orally focused” behavior is to be expected.

In our experience, the two best techniques for reacting to puppy nipping are: 1. When petting a puppy, make it a point to give the puppy something to chew on other than your hand. As you pet with one hand, offer a chewie in the other. 2. When puppy does bite, make a high pitched “Yipping” sound, just like another puppy would, walk away and ignore the puppy for a few minutes. Return, and try petting or playing with her again. She must learn that not biting causes you to stay and play with her, biting makes you go away.

Avoid physical, confrontational techniques such as scruff shakes, pinning the puppy, slapping its nose, or putting fingers down the puppy’s throat. These reactions are ill-advised and often cause much more serious problems. Puppy nipping has nothing to do with “dominance” which is the justification for most of these harsh techniques.

Because puppies’ teeth are so sharp, it’s understandable why puppy parents can’t wait for puppies to outgrow this stage, but patience is the order of the day. Getting frustrated and then getting physical will backfire. Our three “do’s” are all most puppy owners need – recognize when puppy is tired and give her a quiet place to rest, give puppy a chewie whenever she’s touched, and walk away if she bites.
 
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